Jenny Beth sits down with the President of ForAmerica, David Bozell. David shares his perspective on engaging conservatives online, real conservative leadership, and a personal story about Rush Limbaugh.
Jenny Beth sits down with the President of ForAmerica, David Bozell. David shares his perspective on engaging conservatives online, real conservative leadership, and a personal story about Rush Limbaugh.
Twitter: @ForAmerica | @DavidBozell | @JennyBethM
Link: Rush Limbaugh appearance at MRC GALA
David Bozell (00:00):
Other than Trump in 2016, the Republican party has struggled since the Gingrich years because they don't cut any government.
Narrator (00:11):
Keeping. Our Republic is on the line and it requires Patriots with great passion, dedication, and eternal vigilance to preserve our freedoms. Jenny Beth Martin is the co-founder of Tea Party Patriots. She's an author, a filmmaker, and one of time magazine's most influential people in the world. But the title she's most proud of is Mom To Her Boy, girl Twins. She has been at the forefront fighting to protect America's core principles for more than a decade. Welcome to the Jenny Beth Show.
Jenny Beth Martin (00:43):
David Bozell is the president of For America, an organization that has one of the largest social media followings in the conservative movement for America, focuses on having an impact on major public policy issues by engaging conservatives to take action online together with Tea Party Patriot's. Action, David and For America played a major role in ushering in the new Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson. David Zel, thank you so much for being with
David Bozell (01:10):
Me today. Thank you. Thank you. I'm
Jenny Beth Martin (01:12):
Appreciate it. I'm really excited to have you on the show. You have an organization for America and you largely engage people on social media through that, right? Yep.
David Bozell (01:24):
For America was born in 2010, right on the heels of Obama's first election win. He had used social media, particularly Facebook with weapons grade precision, and we decided that we needed to plant the flag of conservatism, particularly on Facebook. And obviously it's advanced beyond Facebook into Twitter, x, Instagram, everything else. But we decided to see if we could recruit an audience. And I remember we approached Facebook back in September of 2010 and we said, how many conservatives do you think you have on your platform? And the executive said, we think about 800,000 now. Back then they had a United States user base of about 43 million people. So we just did the sort of obvious math, 800,000 conservatives out of 43 million people. That doesn't make any sense. So not even they knew that there was this hotbed of conservatism on these platforms.
Jenny Beth Martin (02:23):
They think everyone's liberal,
David Bozell (02:24):
Right? So we decided to, we set some goals to see if we can create a fan base. Within like five weeks. We had 300,000 fans. Within six months we had 1000001.2. We stopped sort of trying to add it via paid advertising when we hit 7 million because at some point you're kind of just watching rubble bounce in the social media sphere. Once you get to a point, particularly on Facebook, if they allow the big pages to just sort of commandeer the entire platform, it would just be the Kim Kardashian show all day long. So there's sort of a leveling off as to your growth. So we hit 7 million, we've got 7.2 right now holding steady, and then we've got another million plus on all the other platforms. And we've tried to take a more creative approach than a typical Washington think tank. We try to marry pop culture to the news of the day.
(03:24):
So it's been a ton of fun. There are a lot of groups that wake up every day and try to maybe choose violence metaphorically, trying to just pick a fight every step of the way. And yes, there are fights to be taken and fights to be picked, and we certainly did that during the recent speakers fight, but at the end of the day, we're all Americans. We're trying to preach American exceptionalism, trying to explain what that means, particularly to a younger audience. So it's been a ton of fun. The engagement is still through the roof. We're super excited to have such a loyal fan base that responds to our calls to activism. It's a terrific investment because we don't have to pay to Reese the same people every single year for the same thing. We keep our folks engaged all year long, and then when we need activism, we can call and they know that we're a trusted source. So we're super thrilled about it.
Jenny Beth Martin (04:22):
And your posts with For America, they're fun. I mean, they're dealing with serious issues, but a lot of times they're much more fun. They're not just either screeds of anger, the picking violence, picking fights that you talked about, but sometimes they just poke fun at the left or have fun with
David Bozell (04:44):
The culture. Well, yesterday we had a post of Zelensky where he said, just if you don't want to give me money, give me credit and I'll pay you back. And so we superimposed him with a backdrop of a casino. It's like, this is what the degenerate gambler says. Just give me credit and I'll pay you back. I can win it back. I can win it back. Just that kind of fun type of product. But then at the end of the day, there's a serious mission that we're trying to accomplish. We want conservatism advanced, particularly at the federal level. We want the federal government off people's backs as country's in 33 trillion in debt. We're spending $2 trillion more than we're taking in. We shouldn't even be taking in 5 trillion versus the 7 trillion that we're spending. These are programs that the country didn't ask for that don't work that are being passed with politicians who pulled numbers are in the toilet and whose programs Republicans have promised to get rid of time and time and time and time again.
(05:52):
And I think what you saw last night or this fall with Virginia and other places around the country is a deep seated frustration with the base of the Republican party that they're just being left at the altar time and time again, and the Republicans are being made to pay by the base. But we try to educate folks as much as possible. But then at the end of the day, we are an issue advocacy organization, so there's going to be certain pieces of legislation that we sink our teeth into. Board of Security is chief among them, and anything that cuts spending, I am all for.
Jenny Beth Martin (06:32):
And you engaged in the speaker fights in January of 2023 and then again in the fall.
David Bozell (06:38):
Yeah, yeah. A ton of fun and pretty simple. My opinion at the beginning of the year was this, if Kevin McCarthy or remember was the speaker was going to be, if they didn't cut Joe Biden's government substantially, that the Republican party was never going to cut anyone's government ever. Like I said just a second ago, Joe Biden's numbers are in the toilet. Take the IRS expansion for example, which it's the only promise Kevin really made. The only promise that Kevin really, really made when he ascended the speakership in terms of specific legislation that he was going to gut the IRS expansion, the 88,000 plus. So let's look at that just first. Politically. Politically, the IRS has no natural constituency defending it, right? It is ripe for the taking. There's sort of Trump Biden and then sort of Congress. And then way down here is the IRS in terms of approval rating or way down here. Nobody wants the IRS in their lives. Nobody was clamoring to increase it by, what was it, 188 billion. Of course I can see the fact checkers, that's not the exact number.
Jenny Beth Martin (07:58):
Whatever the number was, whatever
David Bozell (07:59):
The number
Jenny Beth Martin (08:00):
Was, I wasn't wanting people to increase it by a dollar.
David Bozell (08:02):
Nobody was clamming for it. And at the end of the day, my position was because I know the Bidens and I know sort of how they operate, this was not a piece of legislation that was designed. It was sort of written as such, but it was not to go after the rich guy, make sure he pay his pace, his fair share. And it wasn't not even going to go after the person who's got that $600 Venmo though that became sort of a talking point. This was to get rid of the conservative movement just to audit us to death. And I sort kind of see that clearly as their goal. So Kevin comes in, I'm thinking, okay, he's either going to be the greatest speaker and cut some of this stuff, or he's out of here. And if you can't draw up the gumption to cut something of Joe Biden's with his approval ratings in the toilet, his programs that nobody asked for, then he deserved to get punted.
(09:08):
Fast forward to the debt deal. His failing was he sends in a team of congressmen that were kind of member services, congressmen, Garrett Graves, John McHenry, make sure that the New York delegation is taken care of. Make sure that the California delegation is taken care of. Make sure that this member who's in a Biden district plus three is taken care of. What does Biden do? Biden sends in his OMB director who knows the policies inside and out, but also understands the politics behind them and just mops the floor with these guys in the negotiation. And these guys come out and they say, we did a great job because look, California, our guys in California are taken care of. And look, our guys in New York are taken care of. Well, what did you get in return? 1.2 billion off the 2023 IRS thing, which amounted to 0.0001% of it promise kept look at us.
(10:15):
It was just insufficient, wholly insufficient. And they don't understand. The Republican leadership apparatus just doesn't understand that they don't need to play the left's game as it relates to, well, there's only three or four must pass pieces of legislation so that we must pass 'em, so therefore we'll try our hardest to get what we want. And those four, why can't border security be a must pass piece of legislation? Why can't life be a piece of must pass legislation? If you're not going to elevate these issues to must pass status, you're kind of not taking them seriously. And so Kevin just didn't really have a plan to execute in any way, shape or form a lot of talk. And then Matt Gaetz basically took the high ground and kind of comes over the top and says, well, not only have we not done anything, but you also promised that we would have single subject bills.
(11:18):
You also promised that you would subpoena Hunter Biden. You also promised, actually you also promised why you haven't done any of that. And so while everyone was making sort of a process argument, gates comes over the top and says, look, we're in the results business and we have not delivered anything and the enthusiasm gap, and I give Gates a lot of credit, he can kind of read the enthusiasm gap better than any member. And he understood that the enthusiasm gap was awful, was in the toilet. So I supported the motion to vacate. You were tremendously. You were just the tip of the spear on a lot of what we did. And I can't thank you and your organization enough. Thank you. I mean, we had a lot of fun and some private chats and trying to make sure that this happened, but that's necessary. We've been left at the altar. Our memberships have been left at the altar and Kevin McCarthy paid the political price for it.
Jenny Beth Martin (12:25):
When you look at what you said a minute ago about playing the left's game and the left brings in the Office of Management and Budget and Obama's people who run the government and know how the money is spent, well, first we have someone who's an expert on that on our side of the aisle, Russ Vote, who did that for President Trump. So it's not like the expertise is unavailable to members of Congress if they want to use it. And Russ is amazing with
David Bozell (12:57):
That. I would've sent Russ in as the lead negotiator, right?
Jenny Beth Martin (13:01):
Bring Russ in and say We're working with
David Bozell (13:03):
Him one O and B director to another, right, and fight it out. And the thing you would know that you would get out of Russ, and I think you're going to get this out of Mike Johnson, is that he's going to take the conservative goal as far as he can take it, rather than the Republican establishments sort of Mo is again, let's just make sure that nobody has to take a tough vote. Let's make sure that no one member may have been Gates again, made an excellent point. I hadn't considered it during all of this. We've been talking about cutting spending for years since Obamacare.
Jenny Beth Martin (13:44):
Got it, since 2009 at
David Bozell (13:45):
Least, right? I mean that's essentially the birth of the Tea party is cutting spending and I think it was Gates, but if it's not, I apologize, but he said, look, these members don't want to have a microscope on the cuts. They'll cut stuff, but they don't want their individual district's projects cut in any way, shape or form. That's why you get these sort of uninspiring. Well, let's cut it 2% across the board. Well, okay, well what are we cutting? Cuts are interesting, but interesting cuts are more interesting. And so that's been a big dilemma for the party, but the party needs to understand that you're not going to win races being Democrat light. You can't be the claim to be the party of limited government unless you actually limit some and they haven't done it in like 30 years. And that really to me explains, I mean, what that thinking has sort of birthed the line of the uni party, but it also, I think to me it just explains the Republican party's struggles except for Trump in 2016, but other than Trump in 2016, the Republican party has struggled since the Gingrich years because they don't cut any government.
Jenny Beth Martin (15:21):
And they did well in 2010 when it came to elections. But before Congress even started, the leadership had co-opted most of the freshmen who went in with the Tea Party class.
David Bozell (15:33):
Well, there's that. I mean, the country reflexively does not like Congress doing big things. One of the great stories that I had read was it was something from a 5 38, that website is not defunct, but they had a great story back in 2019 in which it charted the number of CRS over the years, and it's very wonky, very boring, but the story was left wing framed. It was if there's an average number of 4.2 continuing resolutions per year since 1998, yawn, nobody caress, but they were complaining. It's like in years that were higher than the average. This was when government was very inefficient. I didn't get my passport on time, blah, blah, blah. And so the framing was, government is inefficient when there's lots of crs. But if you looked at the chart, if you looked at the election year after a number, if there were more CRS than the average, right, in which Congress just sort of limped along despite its supposed inefficiencies, Congress really didn't change hands either chamber, it just sort of stayed the status quo.
(16:54):
But in years in it was underneath the average, which in which that meant they did a gigantic spending bill or they passed Obamacare or they passed the bush bailout. If they pass that in years in which they pass massive bailouts, massive spending bill, the country punishes them. And it's party agnostic because sometimes Republicans have done this. The country reflexively does not like Congress doing big things. So if this Congress under the stewardship of Mike Johnson Nichols and dimes its way to a big sort of gold chart on a blackboard, great. I think the country is going to reward them if they do it that way. If they try to do a massive conservative bill, as much as I might like it, I think the country would punish them because the country has shown historically that they don't like Congress doing big things, but they've got to figure out a way to get back to their roots, their core competencies.
(18:01):
How did Gingrich and Tom de delay and Dick army, do you remember the number one issue of the 2000 campaign? I am not sure. Tell me what to do with the social security slash fund, the lockbox. You can't lock. We had a surplus. It was what to do with the surplus. It was the big issue. Do we cut taxes or do we put it in a social security lockbox from then? And that was all because of Gingrich and Tom de delay running, and we had a president who was willing to cut spending as well, and Clinton saw the tea leaves, right? Wouldn't mind having him back actually given some of the players that we've had since then.
(18:49):
But those guys came together and ran a deficit free government. It was humming along, no surprise, 2000, nothing really changed. Everybody was sort of nickeling diming their way. Obviously we had a heated election, but the issue was what did you with the surplus? Fast forward 23 years and we're 33 trillion in the whole because George W. Bush and his administration and the Congress, that, and it hasn't mattered. I think that's one of the other big frustrations with both of our audiences, whether we have the White House, it doesn't mattered whether we have the White House plus the house. It doesn't matter whether we have all three. It doesn't matter whether we have one of the three, it doesn't matter. Every combination has been tried except for this one, except for the small majority of the house. And I just wish that the house would stick its chest out a little bit and understand that they're the ones that are constitutionally mandated stewards of resources. They are not the Senate and not play this game. Okay, we'll wait for whatever Mitch McConnell wants to send us. It's not even his job. His job is to approve staff. That's the chief responsibility of the sentence is proof staff. The chief responsibility of the house is to approve the money, and I just wish they'd stop abdicating their responsibilities. I mean, how many times have we seen somebody to Washington and I'll go fight the EPA and the mailer.
(20:38):
How about you just not fund it? Right? Right. I mean, so these things are simple and it takes some gumption and because of sort of the muscle memory in this town where it's, well, when are you going to fold? Right? You can see it all the Washington rags. Okay, so you get eight more days until you fold, right? Right, right. The clock is ticking seven more days into a shutdown, then you're going to fold. Right? Right. You going to fund the government. I mean the muscle memory is
Jenny Beth Martin (21:08):
That they'll pull out the bill that's in the back that's already been written that.
David Bozell (21:11):
Exactly. Exactly. And I think Mike Johnson's not playing that game, and I think that's why he's there.
Jenny Beth Martin (21:24):
We really have just changed so much from the Gingrich years to where we are right now. And yeah, Gingrich in January and in the fall, he was advocating to just leave Kevin McCarthy alone or to make Kevin McCarthy speaker or to Patrick mc, whatever it might be. But what I think he fails to understand, I think he was looking at it as his time as speaker and how hard it would've been if he had had the motion to vacate or had those kind of challenges. Well, the difference is when he was speaker, he actually was using regular order still. They weren't where we are right now in Congress. I think even if he were speaker right now, forget the slim majority, just the way that they're functioning right now, there's no way you would be able to accomplish what they were able to accomplish in the nineties with the balanced budget if they continue with continuing resolutions and no appropriation bills and all of the other
David Bozell (22:22):
Items. Gris had a little bit of a leg up on McCarthy too. Gris had earmarks. That's true.
Jenny Beth Martin (22:30):
Explain that to the audience.
David Bozell (22:31):
Well, it's basically vote horse trading Congressman, I know you're a pro board, but you are going to be absent on this Mexico City policy vote. So that passes and in exchange, what do you need for that basketball arena for inner city youth? 80 million. And that's sort of an over exaggeration, but that's essentially how it could be done back then. Now you got earmarked bands, it's tougher. Look, I was real critical of New Gingrich and his criticism of the Gang of 20 and the Gang of eight. I did not appreciate his commentary. You're trying to sell us a bill of goods on the debt deal. He thought it was a great deal. He called, I mean I was on a call, he called the gang of eight economic terrorists. I thought it was unbecoming of a former speaker to talk about. I know he's trying to defend Kevin and I know he's the Kevin Whisperer or vice versa, but I just thought everyone complains about conservatives not being team players. Where was that? I mean, these guys stood up for what they were promised, not necessarily what they were promising, what they were promised. And maybe that doesn't mean a lot in this town anymore, but to them it did.
Jenny Beth Martin (24:04):
That's right.
David Bozell (24:05):
And so that's sort of the beauty of a small majority. These guys can flex their muscles a little bit. And so I appreciate Newt Gingrich's disagreement over how all that went down, but I don't appreciate his commentary on trying to sell us a bill of goods on this bill on anything that Kevin tried to accomplish because it wasn't any good. And then some of the personal invective he threw at both gangs during both periods. They didn't pick a fight with him.
Jenny Beth Martin (24:37):
No, they didn't. And Obama called the Tea Party movement terrorists and you have Gingrich and other people. When conservatives speak up, we wind up being called terrorists. It's absolutely insulting. It's one of the most despicable things I think that they can label us as. And after the speaker was vacated, we actually saw what real terrorists are like to remind the world what they actually look like and the vitriol and the hyperbole. Sometimes you need to be very careful with the words you use. One of the rules we have with our social media and our emails in general, we don't use the word enemy about fellow Americans. Really, we are not enemies.
David Bozell (25:29):
It's a good rule thumb.
Jenny Beth Martin (25:30):
There are fellow citizens. The enemies are the people who actually want to kill us because we're Americans, and it frustrates me that elected leaders can't have that same kind of respect for their fellow politicians or the citizens who they're supposed to represent.
David Bozell (25:46):
Look, I think new Congress needs to go outside and touch some grass, and I'll just leave it at that. It just go sign the direct mail copy that you're yearning to and go get your 10%. Some of it too is a boomer thing. They just can't. It's a generation that can't let go. I'm not trying to disparage the entire generation of people, but people who are in power from that generation, they're still around. They can't let go. Why?
Jenny Beth Martin (26:21):
And Newt was my congressman when he was Speaker of the House, and I learned so much from him and from the people who worked on his campaign had I not learned the things that I learned from him and a few other things along the way, but the Go Pack seminars, just him explaining how Washington works and he's a professor by trade, so he enjoys teaching people. I wouldn't have been prepared to help organize the Tea Party movement into a movement. It would've just been a blip in time without learning what I learned from him. So I have a lot of respect for him. It's just frustrating when we see the kind of vitriol that we see or the attacks against the
David Bozell (27:02):
People who are advocating. You're tough. We can take it, but it's unnecessary, right? Absolutely. Same team. One team, one goal.
Jenny Beth Martin (27:14):
One of the things that I have noticed looking at Speaker Johnson social media, and as we're recording this, he hasn't been speaker very, very long yet. He has a positive optimistic outlook for America and it's obvious that he loves our country. Before we started recording, I was mentioning how I love how your social media does have a bit more mocking and lighthearted bent to it, and how much I just Ms. Rush Limbaugh. Things are so bad and when things were bad while Rush was around, you could just turn the radio on for three hours a day anytime during that time, and you would get a dose of something that would make you smile again because you love the country and we're missing that right
David Bozell (28:01):
Now. Real leadership void out there without rush. There's been a lot of times where you think we're doing the right thing. What would Rush say about this? I think he would've been behind the speaker change completely. I think so he would've understood it. I think he would've been calling for it. I think he would've told Kevin McCarthy to step down with class and with Grace before you get tossed because you make commitments that you clearly were not prepared to follow through on. It's just sort of a guess as to where I think Rush might be. His legacy of philanthropy is out of this world. I mean, he literally saved thousands of kids' lives through some private philanthropy that not very many people know about. So I revered the guy and I'm sure everybody misses him. It's sad. As we approach primary season, people are starting to stake like who their candidate is and everything is personal, everything and it's personal.
(29:08):
And I got my phone somewhere's, just keyboard warrior stuff, and some of these guys that are coming up now, they're starting to have young kids. You can actually see some guys that were used to be nastier than they are now. They have kids now that's good, but we've got too many on the right who are just waking up every day and saying, I'm going to pick a fight here. I'm going to pick a fight there. Click, click, click, click, click. I'm going to get into that guy's comments and that guy's mentions, and some of it is just sort of blind ideology to one candidate or another, and it's not just, there's a lot of criticism for people who just sort of blindly follow Trump, and it's DeSantis now too. People are sort of DeSantis bust, so sort of going to stay away from that for the short term. I don't think it does us any good whatsoever. Those guys are two talented guys.
(30:12):
They can handle this each other on their own. They're running for the top spot in the world, the top job in the world. Neither of these gentlemen are afraid of the other. They'll debate in time. I can't wait and let the future of conservatism, at least the immediate future of conservatism, be defined by the winner. And I think we're not communists after all. So competition is going to bring out the best out of both of these guys. So I can't wait for them to join on a debate stage. I think Trump's probably waiting for this crowd to whittle down the size of the field to whittle down. I don't blame 'em. There's no reason to pay good money to go try to get beat up by Chris Christie. I mean, what is the fun in that? That's all you're going to get. So pass and wait for the main event.
(31:16):
But the influencers within the cause, I just wish some of these guys would just choose friendlier skies, friendlier pass in order to be more persuasive. You see it in the abortion debate running rampant within the Republican party that can't figure out what the message is going to be. So people who have a certain message say, well, you're out if you don't agree with this right now. If you're destined to lose unless you agree to a 15 week ban, well, okay, I didn't know that my pro-life bonafides had to start and stop at 15 weeks. I mean, when was that memo thrown in our direction? So it's unnecessary. It's just for the clicks, but these things are cyclical and I think my temperament is always glass half full, so it'll work itself out.
Jenny Beth Martin (32:15):
That's good. Now you said that you've seen some people in line change some because they've had kids. You have kids, right? Has it
David Bozell (32:22):
Changed you? Yeah, three girls. All the girls haven't girls has. I grew up with mostly brothers, but having three daughters has certainly opened my eye to, there's a kinship sisters that I did not appreciate. They seem to know what each other needs, whether it's space, whether it's a challenge, whether it's a good cry, whether it's a pick me up. They seem to know what is needed when it's needed without telling each other, and that's kind of wild to sort of watch, but it does give me time. That's not to say that I definitely enjoy going outside and doing my yard work by myself because indoors it's like cats and just screaming and yelling, a lot of volume and a lot of estrogen running around. But I love 'em. My oldest has just started driving, which is everyone in Northern Virginia should be very afraid. If you're on the road,
Jenny Beth Martin (33:33):
Don't embarrass your daughter. Well,
David Bozell (33:35):
No, she's actually a terrific driver. She'll kill me if I, she's a very good driver. And then I've got another one in high school and another one in grade school. So they're all three of 'em are very, very different. There's Molly, who's too smart for her own good Harper who is as independent as they come, and I just love her. She's like a space cadet, just full of curiosity, opened up my world to Taylor Swift. Oh yeah, I'm a Swifty. And then Claire is the youngest one. She's just the joker in the family.
Jenny Beth Martin (34:16):
My daughter opened my world up to Ed Shean, so she has Ed Shean, and so I've been to Ed Shean concerts and heard every one of his songs. I'm pretty sure several
David Bozell (34:25):
Times I've got Swift. I got Taylor Swift. I try to tell him all the time, Hey, look, there's this tight end in Kansas City. He's trying to pick up this struggling pop star, trying to make her something, and they just chew my head off. Yeah, but it's great.
Jenny Beth Martin (34:41):
That is good. Now, you and your family, you have a family, has a long history of political involvement.
David Bozell (34:51):
Yeah, I was conservative in the womb, I think
Jenny Beth Martin (34:53):
You probably were, and your dad with Media Research Center, you wound up having the opportunity to meet Rush Limbaugh and you were telling me about that. Let's talk about that. I think people will be interested in this story. Kind of a fun
David Bozell (35:08):
Story. So my father has his dishonor awards every year, and it's an event that roasts, the worst of the worst are the liberal media. And Rush was our surprise guest. This was at the Omni Shore Hotel in Washington DC and only myself and Rush, his pilot and his security guard who Rush used to affectionately call Stalin. They kind of were in on it, and my job was to get rush from the industrial entrance in the back through the green room after we landed from Palm Beach and through the Green Room and up the stage from the back. So we had it all mapped out and I had to go to the, I mean should have known, I was just kind of a kid, but I went to the security guard. I said, I have a very special guest coming and no one can know. And the security guy said, dude, I just had the vice president in here three days ago.
(36:04):
Who is it? It's like, it's rush limbo. I was like, okay. Rolls his eyes to us. It was like if we got to hide him, we had a thousand people coming. Nobody knew that he was coming. So at the appointed time and the appointed door, I'm standing there and I get a call from Stalin that says, we're here. And I said, yo, no you're not. You're where you're supposed to be. He said, well, we're in the hotel. It's like, that's not where you're supposed to be. And he says, well, we're in the hotel. I said, okay, well what's around you? He said, well, there's flowers on the floor. The carpet is beige. Okay, there's a fake Monet in the wall. Now, if anyone's been to any hotel in the history of any hotel, they all have flowered carpeting and fake Monets on the wall. I said, so are you just down a hallway?
(36:57):
He said, yeah, we're on the lobby floor. Okay, at least that's something. Well, in the hotel, there's two ways I could go and a 50% chance I was going to be wrong. I book it down one hallway, I guess I could hear them getting louder as I'm running toward the elevator bank at the edge of the hotel, and I turn the corner and I see this bush, this giant fake tree right in front of me and I look, and there's Limbaugh having placed a giant fake tree right in front hiding and then like dinging hotel guests, some of the guests for media research center donors who we're not supposed to know. Hi David, how are you? Hello, Mr. So-and-So thank you very much for your contribution, and I'm just trying to hide Rush Limbaugh from in front of the streets. Why don't you come? No, no, no, that's fine.
(37:46):
I'll be right here. I'll be good. I'm just going to hang out by this tree. And he's just chuckling this booming sort of chuckle of his, but nobody sees him go upstairs. He freshens up, go back down the industrial elevator and we go backstage, meet some folks that were hanging out backstage and the time has come for him to go on stage and he grabs me and he said, okay, so tell me what's going to happen. I said, look, my father's going to close down the show or at least pretend to, and then we're going to have an mc come over the top and he's going to say, Brent, the voice of God, mc in the ballroom, Brent, we've got a special guest and my father's going to sound agitated like, I'm sick of you people. I want to get off the stage. Why are we still here?
(38:39):
And then we're going to play your theme music and we're going to build that to a crescendo and everyone's going to get up and applaud you. Go outside and do whatever you want. He said, should I do a speech? I said, you can go light a cigar and just walk off if you want to and say nothing, and that would be a riot. I said, okay, okay. He's starting to get more and more nervous as this is approaching. Now, this was kind of one of his first public appearances after he had gotten out of rehab for the painkiller addiction. So we were kind of nervous about how it would come off, and he has a love affair for his audience, but for him, whenever he did a public appearance, he was the star, so he had to be good. So he says, well, are there going to be stage lights?
(39:38):
I said, well, yeah, of course. It's the stage. I mean, yeah, it's going to be stage lights. He said, okay, well what if they don't applaud? And okay, now you're kind of being a little bit of a prima donna. Yeah, dude, buddy, there's a thousand people here. They all worship you. They're going to applaud and they're going to be stunned that you're here. They haven't seen you in probably a year in the flesh. Yeah, they're they're going to applaud. I said, okay, okay, and I can do whatever I want. I said, yeah, okay. So he kind of sort of gets tightened up. My father on cue pretends to shut down the show Voice of God Music, applause Rush goes on stage and proceeds to give one of the best. It's still on RC dot org's website if you want to check it out. He proceeds to give one of the best 45 minute talks off the cuff, no notes in a way that funny, still timely in a way that only Rush could deliver.
(40:43):
It was out this world good. And I mean just multiple standing ovations throughout, and it only dawned on me later with the stage lights. He was blind and with his implants, I guess this must've been preempt. It had to be pre-plant, then pre-plant post rehab. But his hearing loss, he was deaf. And so what he was trying to tell me was, I'm about to give a speech blind and deaf, and I hope this works out. I haven't done this in a year. And it was terrific and it was just an amazing feat from Talent on Loan from God, but it was just an awesome thing to sort of watch. And so if you ever want to at a gentleman who's giving a speech literally blind and deaf and knows the applause lines, I would recommend everyone to go to mrc.org and check out the Saunas archives, the one from the Omni Shore that I think it's 20 25 0 6. Yeah,
Jenny Beth Martin (41:54):
It's beautiful in, besides, we probably could use hearing him right about now anyway.
David Bozell (41:59):
Oh yeah. Rough
Jenny Beth Martin (42:01):
In America.
David Bozell (42:02):
Occasionally I'll go to his website and just find some old clips and old shows and just stumble on something that's is incredibly useful, and I'll just sort of steal it and tweet it out as if it's mine, because why not? It was on loan from God, so I'll just loan it from the God's website. That's the way I look at it. But he's a wonderful guy and we miss him terribly, and I think you and I and our professional capacities have tried to fill a little bit of those big shoes. We're certainly not the professional broadcasters that he was. There's a lot of people trying to be, and I admire them for their effort. It's not necessarily my cup of tea. There's certain lanes and zones for all of us, but I wish our cause would recognize, because I saw this firsthand with my own family reading about the schism between my grandfather and Bill Buckley, and I don't talk about this a lot, but these are two best friends who got in an argument about politics and it severed their friendship for 30 years, and there's a lot of ego, and I just don't have any real time or temperament to pick fights with fellow conservatives about their conservatism.
(43:39):
Yes, there are times we have to define what it is for the good of the order, but some of the personal objective that goes back and forth on some of these platforms, it's just it's not worth the energy,
Jenny Beth Martin (43:57):
Not
David Bozell (43:57):
Productive.
Jenny Beth Martin (43:58):
You can attack the issue without attacking the people, and you can have disagreements, even loud disagreements without heating one another. And
David Bozell (44:11):
How much infected do we get when we were pushing for an alternative to Kevin back in January, or an alternative to Kevin back back in October, September from our own guys, from our own routine, it is chaos. It's clown show. Keystone cops. What are you guys doing? I said, well, is Kevin doing a good job? Is he advancing conservatism satisfactory to you? If he is, that's satisfactory. Your bar is pretty low, man. I mean really, there's a lot of money, a lot of resources, a lot of energy, a lot of good names being put on the line for the pursuit of getting government off our case and advancing a cultural worldview that you and I subscribe to that our membership subscribes to. A lot of good names being put on the line. I don't need to hear that. Kevin McCarthy and his leadership team were doing a bang up job for nine months. They weren't. Don't lie to me.
(45:21):
What's that line? Pee in my head and tell me it's raining. I mean, come on. So I want high expectations for our costs. I think you do too. I think Tea Party Patriots does. It's good to have high expectations. It's good to be pragmatic when I think we are, but it's better to have high expectations, especially when they promise. I mean, I didn't promise to get rid of the IRS, Kevin McCarthy did. I didn't promise he stood up. I remember a press conference I tweeted back in, I guess that had to have been July. I said, if he doesn't do this, he's out of here. It was a press conference who said the goal for the fall is to spend less than the year before.
Jenny Beth Martin (46:13):
It's so inspiring.
David Bozell (46:14):
Well, first off, I mean, yeah, I mean it's just like you could just, oh, okay, great. That's like one penny less great. Where do I sign up if it's raining? I'm definitely not coming out to vote for you, but okay, that was his promise, right? The goal was to spend less. So then what does he do? He puts the cr, which is the same. He spends the same. Well, okay, you're out of here, dude. You said you wanted to spend less. You had no plan to do so you purposely backed it up so you could say, well, I guess we've got to do a cr, we just got to spend the same, come on. I need more independent creative approaches to that right
Jenny Beth Martin (47:02):
Now as we look to 2024 for the elections, without going to candidates as much, just what do you think the party and conservatives and candidates need to be doing so that we can win?
David Bozell (47:20):
Well, the party needs to solve this abortion talking point issue. If you can't talk about the fact that it's wrong to kill a baby in its late stages of pregnancy, you should just give up. Honestly. I mean, if you're a politician who just can't sort of utter that easily simply and find another way of life, find another way to make a living. It seems awfully silly to me that post Dobbs, that the Republican Party, the Republican Party ought to be taking a leadership role as to how it wants to address this. What does it stand for? So I'd like to see the party take that issue on. I think it would be uniquely positioned. I think it would sort of give them some gravitas if they decide to be serious about it. I don't think they will, but there's some conservative groups that need to sort of band together and do it for them if necessary.
(48:30):
I'm sure we'll be a part of that from the candidate's perspectives, as much as I know they won't, I'd love for them to keep it clean, keep it about the issues, but I know they won't. So it's kind of a fool's errand. But I do hope for a good clean race. I do think DeSantis has a wonderful future. I'm not so sure that he's ready for this moment, but that's just a personal thing. I be convinced I can be talked out of that easily. I mean, everyone loves him for all the reasons that we know, and he stood up on Covid for the most part, his stuff at the education on an issue of education, and it's been terrific. Terrific. It's exactly the kind of fresh thinking we need. And he knows, as a former member of Congress, actually, I thought Ron DeSantis might be a sleeper speaker pick because he was a former member, right?
(49:30):
That could be sort of an out, right. Okay, maybe I'll go. I'll aim for 2028 in the meantime, I'll go be the speaker. For a while I thought that would be a cool job, but, but I hope the candidates keep it clean, keep it above board. I hope the party and the conservative movement can coalesce around what the message is going to be on abortion because the Democrats are going to run on abortion one, abortion two, abortion three, abortion four and a portion of five. So you either combat that in a proactive, inspiring way, or you're going to be in the minority for quite some time. I think Biden can easily be beaten, should be beaten, no excuse for it not to beat him, and I think you will be, I'm a big believer in Alan Litman's 11 Presidential Keys. He's 11. Oh, so it's kind of tough to argue with 11 and oh, and if you answer those keys now, I think Biden's six to the negative, and that would mean a challenger would win. So I think he will be beaten by somebody. I think we both get asked the same common question all the time. How could Trump win a presidency from prison?
Jenny Beth Martin (50:49):
Not because we want him to be in prison, but because of what we're looking at.
David Bozell (50:53):
We're looking at
Jenny Beth Martin (50:53):
Right, the weaponization of government
David Bozell (50:55):
And there is no, how do you win the presidency from prison book for dummies? Nobody knows. I think the closest cop to that would be Nelson Mandela. Maybe you follow some strategic messaging, the blueprint that Nelson Mandela used, and then take your chances and go from there. To me though, I mean, does the Republican Party fund the prosecution of its nominee is potentially the most important question of them all. And I think that explains a lot of the damper of enthusiasm, the tamp down enthusiasm for anything going on in these statewide races. These guys are funding our own demise, and so why bother? But the holidays over, everyone's got to sort of get the fog lifted and focus anew. But I'd be demanding your member of Congress, whether you like Trump or not. I mean, these charges are bogus, all designed to take you out of the game, all designed to dampen your enthusiasm. But the real kick in the shins is that we're paying for it. That's the real kick in the shins, and I think people are sick of it, and people have put certain members in office expecting results. We're results oriented business, and I can tell Corey Lewandowski on my shoulder, well, elections are about the future, but if you have nothing to sell, it's kind of difficult to sell the future.
(52:52):
Then the press is going to say that Biden's great. You dumb American voter. Don't you like inflation? So we're going to have to tackle those things. You
Jenny Beth Martin (53:01):
Just don't understand inflation really. It's good. You don't understand how it
David Bozell (53:04):
Works, right? It's all necessary. You got to build the bottom up, blah, blah, blah. It's insane. It's one of the things I'm also looking at or how legitimate are these polls Anyway, any poll, pro candidate polls, New York Times polls, Rasmussen Poll, not to pick on, but conservative polls, everybody seems to be more wrong than, so some of the stuff, as we're predicting these things, it is going to be a little bit more relied upon upon your instinct, your enthusiasm of your audience, and it's going to be up to the conservative movement led by Jenny Beth Martin to keep enthusiasm levels high. Because sadly, I mean, we've seen the Republican parties attempt at this and they're just not very good at it. They're not very good at it. They're very good at raising money. I'll give 'em that. But I think we have to have a come to Jesus with them about, okay, we have got to be on the same page. We got to be frenemies for the next 11 months, and we are going to have to play a role in that. And if we were to pull this off in 2024, we better be demanding of what we want, which is much, much smaller government.
Jenny Beth Martin (54:38):
Absolutely. We have to have smaller government. It can't continue. We saw what happens and how tyrannical a big government can be during Covid lockdowns, and it's just gotten worse when you look at the prosecutions and the weaponization of the government against the candidates and against Americans as well. It's just the level of distrust that Americans have with the government at this point on either side of the political aisle. It's dangerous for our country,
David Bozell (55:13):
And the real kick in the shins is that we're paying for it. I mean, that's where it's just a real killer for a lot of people. It's like, man, I'm struggling to, I bought a stick of butter yesterday for $6, I mean $6 for a stick of butter. I mean, it's absurd. And so people are struggling to put the necessities on the table, enjoy the fruits of their labor, put their kids in schools, and meanwhile, we're paying for, I mean, it's not just sort of the wasteful sort of silly spending that you see, cocaine, mice in hamster wheels. There's still that. I mean, that's absurd on its face. There's still plenty of that, but now you're going to pay to prosecute our guy,
Jenny Beth Martin (56:05):
Prosecute our guy, pay to indoctrinate our kids, pay to turn the military into some woke social experiment rather than make sure it's ready to defend us, should we need to in a war. These are things that we're paying for that are harming American, harming our lives
David Bozell (56:26):
In a normal sort of historical timeframe. Russia invades Ukraine, Hamas attacks Israel. God forbid anything happened here, but you'd see an uptick in military recruitment. It's like, okay, I'm not going to let that come here. I'm going to go defend our allies. People don't see any of that. You don't see any enthusiasm for recruitment, so I am totally with you. The house needs to stick us just out here and say, this is our show. And I love Speaker Johnson when he says, we are here to be stewards of taxpayer resources. That's it. That is it. That is high level, high ground stuff. If he can write the laws and see that they're enforced the way this house writes, we'll be well on our way.
Jenny Beth Martin (57:26):
Very good. Well, David, how can people find more information about you and about For America?
David Bozell (57:32):
Yeah, for america.org. F-O-R-A-M-E-R-I ca.org. Pretty easy. That's the same across the board in all the Twitter accounts, Facebook accounts. So after the Backslash for America, got a ton of fun. Just sign up. We do a Saturday newsletter called the Canon, which is kind of a summary of what we've put out through the week, and then share some other group stuff that we like. So we try to be kind of a good housekeeping seal of approval as to what's funny out there in the conservative movement. So we're having a blast doing it, and we're super excited about what lies ahead for the Republicans in this Congress, and hopefully we can come together as a unit and make some magic happen.
Jenny Beth Martin (58:19):
Well, I certainly hope so, and I appreciate you joining me today. Thank you. And everything you do, the conservative movement.
David Bozell (58:25):
Thank you. Appreciate
Jenny Beth Martin (58:26):
It. Thank you so much. David Bozel. Thank you. This was David Bozel with Four America. I'm Jenny Beth Martin, and this is a Jenny Beth show.
Narrator (58:34):
The Jenny Beth Show is hosted by Jenny Beth Martin, produced by Kevin Mohan and directed by Luke Livingston. The Jenny Beth Show is a production of Tea Party Patriots action. For more information, visit tea party patriots.org.
Jenny Beth Martin (58:54):
If you like this episode, let me know by hitting the light button or leaving a comment or a five star review. And if you want to be the first to know, every time we drop a new episode, be sure to subscribe and turn on notifications for whichever platform you're listening on. If you do these simple things, it will help the podcast grow, and I'd really appreciate it. Thank you so much.